Weinland Watch

Weinland Watch

An Exchange With a Prospective Member

Below the cut, a series of letters sent to someone enquiring about baptism.

Dear [name], thank you for your email. It is always very exciting when God begins to call a person and they always desire to share with others what they see. It does not take long to see that others do not share the same excitment for the truth. This is because God does the calling and He alone gives spiritual vision. You are best to focus in on gaining as much truth as possible and be a student, only give an answer when ASKED.If you follow the steps below you will come to see that God has not called you to be part of the 144,000 but for another purpose which will lead you to be part of His family in the future.If you are genuinely seeking a relationship with God, you should follow the steps below:As God continues to open the minds of increasing numbers of people, we have come to a time when we are no longer able to handle the growing volume of e-mail and letters. We do not have the resources or manpower to continue answering all questions, therefore, we are compelled to respond by sending Form Letters. Those who are genuine about their calling will follow the instruction that is given and will receive the kind of help necessary to properly respond to God. This is a standard form letter.Over the weeks and few months that follow, God will begin drawing millions to His truth and to repentance. As God does this, it is not His will that people question what He is giving, but that people search out what He has so mercifully made available to them. The primary thing each person needs to understand is that you must be willing to search out answers through your own efforts. For nearly all questions, you can receive answers if you will do more searching and digging on your own with the resources we have made available to you. This letter will help you to do this in the best manner possible. By reading The Prophesied End-Time and 2008-Gods Final Witness, you will naturally have questions that you would like to have answered. Not all of your questions will be answered, and you will simply have to focus on the knowledge that God is granting to you. You have before you all that is needed in order to properly respond to Gods calling, if you are genuine about your desire to repent and change your life, so that you might have the opportunity to live into the new age that is now coming to this earth. If you follow the steps outlined below, you will have all that is needed, at this time, to properly equip you for the coming of Jesus Christ:

 

I The most important thing you must do is to repent of your false beliefs and practices, and wrong ways of living, and fully turn to God in obedience to His ways of life. The first step is to keep the Sabbath day holy. If you are not willing to set aside the Sabbath day as God commands, then there is no sense of you reading any farther because God will not work with you, nor receive you, unless you are willing to obey Him in this matter (Isaiah 57, 58 & 59). The Church website (www.cog-pkg.org) has a FAQ tab at the top of the page that you can click onto and read the Form Letter concerning proper Sabbath observance. This will direct you to what you need to do if you are going to obey Gods Sabbath day.

II If you have not thoroughly read both books mentioned above, then you need to do so. After a few weeks you need to go back and read them again. The reason for this is because there is no way that a person can fully understand all they have read from only doing so once or even twice. You will grow in greater understanding the more you come to grasp Gods great purpose that is being worked out for mankind.

III As the Sabbath Form Letter instructs you to go to the church website in order to listen to the Sabbath sermon, you will find a large number of other sermons here as well. You need to begin using wisely the time you have remaining and listen to as many of these as you can. If you are deeply serious and genuine before God, you will be eager to listen to other sermons on the Sabbath, in addition to the live webcast.

IV In addition to the two books and sermons posted on the Church website, there are publications listed that will answer many more questions for you, and although you would like to get a speedy answer, you will simply have to be patient and willing to search out the riches of truth that God has made available to you. The Publications section of the website contains hand-picked literature of Mr. Herbert W. Armstrong. There is more information given here than you have time to truly digest and learn. Focus on what you have been given!

Hand-picked to agree with Weinland’s worldview no doubt.

V Another area for information that would be good to check from time-to-time is the website www.ronaldweinland.com that has been set up to give timely information. Ron Weinlands travels and other pertinent information will be posted (especially in the future) to keep people informed quickly when important events occur that concern this end-time.

VI Through this building process of learning the truths of God, it is good to remember that you are to do so with the attitude of a student (the meaning of a disciple). Many have a difficult time doing this because they try to hold onto old false teachings from traditional Christianity or hold onto their own understanding that they think they have come to see through their own reading and studying, but these are only obstacles in receiving what God is offering you. God is not concerned with what anyone thinks is true, but He is concerned that those whom He is calling are willing to humbly and meekly receive what He is offering them. That which God gives is a matter of spiritual revelation and not a matter of ones own intellect, knowledge, and human understanding.

VII Finally, all must come to understand that there is only one true baptism in life whereby one can be forgiven of all sins. There is one true baptism into Gods one true Church, just as there is only one true Almighty Eternal God. Those who want to be baptized and desire to be begotten of Gods spirit must read and follow the instruction given in the Form Letter on the subject of Baptism, which can be found on the FAQ section of the website.

Sincerely [name of Evangelist #1]
Church of God -PKG

This was the second series of exchanges the prospective member had with the church.

Hello [name]
The meetings conducted by Ronald Weinland are for a Sabbath service and for those who are in the true Church of God or who are being called by God and have responded by turning to obedience in observing the seventh day Sabbath and are committed to keeping/obeying it as God has commanded. Only those who are observing the Sabbath and tithing can be invited to attend such services. If you are one of those people then you need to let us know if you have such commitment and how you are observing the Sabbath, and if you are doing so, we would be glad to extend an invitation to you.

Read this and reply back to this e-mail so we have a record of our conversations. We need contact information such as full address and phone numbers so a minister can contact you.

Sincerely
[Name of Evangelist #2]

the Church of God-PKG

The church’s form letter on baptism follows. You will note that the prospective member is required to divulge personal contact information. Meanwhile, two different evangelists have been in contact with the same member. There was no response to further enquiries from the same member until the following came through:

Hello [name]
 
I am trying to schedule you for baptism. We cannot locate the cashiers check you say you sent. Reply back to this e-mail telling us what name and date it was sent. I have to verify that it was applied properly.
 
thanks
[name of Evangelist #2]

The prospective member did not send any such check in, nor did the person say they sent any such check in. The evangelist was informed of this in the responding email. Additionally, the member requested to attend a baptism in their area, and was not given any permission. The prospective member then went on to request a receipt or a confirmation of their membership in the church before they would start sending money (and rightfully so). This person is now seriously questioning the motives behind the church.

Here was the church’s response to the prospective member’s request for information on tithing (they asked if it was 10% per annum or 10% per pay period).

Hello [name] 

A tithe is that which involves a person’s obedience to God in giving God His tithe (10 percent) of income. This is a tithe of one’s net income (after taxes). The taxes are not in our control, but belong to the government to which we are all subject. We have no power over that portion of our income that is taken as taxes, and Jesus Christ said to give to Caesar what is Caesar’s. We are responsible for what is under our control and management. God’s tithes are sent to Church of God-PKG, P.O. Box 14447, Cincinnati, OH 45250 U.S.A.
 
You can find more information in sermons on our website
www.cog-pkg.org  relating to the topic of Tithing. Feb 19th 2005 titled  “A Relationship with God and Tithing”

Sincerely [name of Evangelist #2]
the Church of God-PKG

As the prospective member noted, they were initially requesting information on baptism, and then got manipulated into requesting information on tithing. This was the exchange that occurred after the prospective member requested the exact details of the baptismal location planned in their area for March 22:

This was the church’s response:

Hello [name]

A tithe is that which involves a person’s obedience to God in giving God His tithe (10 percent) of income. This is a tithe of one’s net income (after taxes). The taxes are not in our control, but belong to the government to which we are all subject. We have no power over that portion of our income that is taken as taxes, and Jesus Christ said to give to Caesar what is Caesar’s. We are responsible for what is under our control and management. God’s tithes are sent to Church of God-PKG, P.O. Box 14447, Cincinnati, OH 45250 U.S.A.
 
You can find more information in sermons on our website
www.cog-pkg.org  relating to the topic of Tithing. Feb 19th 2005 titled  “A Relationship with God and Tithing”
Sincerely [name of Evangelist #2]
the Church of God-PKG

A further request by the prospective member on whether or not they could attend the March 22 baptismal drive met with this response:

Hello [name]

Thank you for your e-mail. Can you help with this matter, as we cannot find a tithe record. I see you expected to mail the tithe in our past e-mails. Reply back to this e-mail as this is a prerequisite to baptism.
Sincerely
[name of Evangelist #2]

The prospective member then replied with an apology that they did not realize tithing was a prerequisite to baptism. The prospective member did not receive a reply to that email, and has not heard from the church since.

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Written by weinlandwatch

March 17, 2008 at 5:59 pm

Posted in Uncategorized

10 Responses

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  1. For the slant and purpose of proving this as a wrong ecclesiastical doctrine of COG-PKG, allow me to take this in a Christian position for a minute…

    I’m certainly glad that the Apostles and Leaders of the New Testament Church didn’t take that position.

    Mark 16:16 Whoever BELIEVES, not tithes.
    Mark 1:5 Confessing their sins was the requirement for baptism, not tithes.

    Acts 2:41 says “Those who accepted his message were baptized, and about three thousand were added that day.” According to this scripture, tithing again was not a mandate for baptism. If it was, they would have had to go home, gather their tithe, and come back. Of course, that’s ridiculous.

    Acts 8:35-38 says:

    ” 35Then Philip began with that very passage of Scripture and told him the good news about Jesus.

    36As they traveled along the road, they came to some water and the eunuch said, “Look, here is water. Why shouldn’t I be baptized?”[a] 38And he gave orders to stop the chariot. Then both Philip and the eunuch went down into the water and Philip baptized him.”

    So, then, what has happened here is that a PKG member has asked “Why shouldn’t I be baptized”. And the answer? You didn’t tithe. The Eunuch said “Why shouldn’t I be baptized”. And Philip baptized him immediately. So then. What’s wrong with this picture? Who is right? Witness Weinland, or Philip – in a Christian perspective?

    Editor’s note: I don’t have an “automatic bible verse link widget” enabled on the blog. All verse links lead directly to the Skeptics Annotated Bible.

    shadowsofwcg

    March 17, 2008 at 10:16 pm

  2. Here is another biblical exegesis (with quotes from a Jewish rabbi no less) on tithing. Anyone who is thinking of sending their money to Weinland needs to read the linked document now.

    As far as Weinland, stay tuned for part three—one family agitated so much after the church member sent in two thousand dollars (that were earmarked for education), Weinland claims the church sent it back (this was in Saturday’s sermon but I haven’t gotten around to “transcribing” it yet).

    Tellingly, Weinland made no mention (in the sermon) of the why or the how of the member feeling compelled to send the church two thousand dollars that was clearly intended for something else.

    weinlandwatch

    March 18, 2008 at 12:04 am

  3. Armstrongism. Armtrongism. Armstrongism. What can I say?

    I would think that I Ronny Boy would try another tactic….. WE NEED YOUR MONEY! God can’t work without MONEY!

    Another thing that always got me about Armstrongism… they say they have complete faith in God….. but they always needed money to build the grand buildings…but then there is a group of Christians praying and worshipping in a broken down two room barn across town…..

    So, get ready PKG…. when Ron’s predictions don’t come true… IT’S GOING TO BE YOUR FAULT! Just like HWA did… GOD didn’t act because YOU STOPPED tithing!!!!!

    WW– I had to throw that in there….. sound familiar?

    Jim Hagerty

    March 18, 2008 at 3:32 am

  4. Sounds familiar. I just wished Weinland sounded that innocuous.

    weinlandwatch

    March 18, 2008 at 2:06 pm

  5. As far as all of us here trying to debunk tithing: The point of this is that the prospective member was originally asking for information on baptism. Very telling no?

    weinlandwatch

    March 18, 2008 at 2:59 pm

  6. I get many people that say, “Well, hes giving the book out for free. He had to print all those books! He travels”…I did a tiny calculation. If he has only 1,000 memebers who tithe 10%. Lets say the average income is 50,000 a year. Thats 5,000 a year, Thats 5 MIL a year! WW – your perspective please…

    Steve

    March 18, 2008 at 5:16 pm

  7. My perspective? Yeah that sounds about right.

    weinlandwatch

    March 18, 2008 at 6:30 pm

  8. You ought to be proud of yourself Mr. Weinland, you have ruined so many lives and turned them against thier BIBLICAL teachings, telling them that church is evil..Shame on you, Scaring people into buying food, paper products, short wave radio etc because the tribulation was suppose to happen! You nut, if the tribulation was going on the WHOLE WORLD would be experiencing it and not just a part of it. You have scared people into believing that if they do not honor the sabbath they will be put to death, so what choice do they have but to honor it in fear and this is not the way GOD works! Heaven and earth will pass away and so if this is the case so wont your warped teaching and you yourself wont be around to know any thing about it because you are probably going to be one of the FIRST to be put to death, oh yeah eternal punishment from GOD himself, so if anyone should be afraid it should be you because mr. you are in danger for deceiving these people like you have, their blood will be on your hands but you didn’t tell them this did you?? Of course not, you snake!!! Your day is coming and I hope they take care of you so ALL your followers will see just how much of a devil you are and you know the church is not evil, its Ronald Weinland, he is the serpent! Beware people, your leader will be chained with his leader for a thousand years and then on to the ETERNAL flames..You blasphemous demon!

    Louise

    April 22, 2008 at 3:29 am

  9. Wow.

    It’s worse than I thought. This guy is a nut-job, as is the church he represents.

    That last post was a little on the extreme side, heheh…well maybe not. Louise might not be that far off if that’s how this guy operates. It’s as simple as this: John the Baptist did not charge money or anything of material value for baptism. Jesus Christ never said anything about money for baptism, nor did the Creator of the universe; these guys are just trying to hit two birds with one stone. If they are operating by the bible, they should do what’s IN the bible as it’s WRITTEN! Ya can’t just grab two key themes and traditions from the bible and smash ’em together like that. They are operating on non-biblical principles (not unbiblical, there’s a difference) and they most likely will either pay for it or…well, pay for it.

    Ian

    May 1, 2008 at 9:07 am

  10. I love it when a church requests a tithe…

    2Cor 9:7, “every man according as he purposeth in his heart, so let him give, not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver.”

    I recite that passage, and they kind of slink off. I am a man of faith, and love for God. I have studied theology, and historical theology and religions. Christian “Religion” (NOT the Faith) is fun to mess with. Every religion has dogma that is based on another aspect of historical mass need. And in that regard, most can find “holes” in dogmatic teachings. This is why it is commonly known that doctrine is held to the translation of each individual reader. Do I sometimes read things and interpret them to mean something COMPLETELY different than others? Of course. Example: Take 10 Men or women at the time of a child’s birthday or gift giving time, give them the EXACT toy to be assembled for their child/children with exactly the same WRITTEN instructions, watch each person assemble the toy, and note how many did it different ways….but finally wound up with a finished product not unlike the others = RELIGION…

    The scripture does one thing. It entertains with a clear and concise message/guidleine on how to live a faithful, fulfilling life in regards to ourselves, family, friends, and others…for the benefit of ALL mankind. Each person is resonsible for THEIR OWN thoughts. God gave us two unchanging gifts between all Men/Women: Life and Free Will.

    I have read Weinlands books, I find them great ENTERTAINMENT. I also enjoy many movies that pertain to End of Days themes, they entertain and open discussion within my familial group. They both have something in common….they are FICTION.

    Good Day.

    Liam

    May 28, 2008 at 9:44 pm


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