Weinland Watch

Weinland Watch

CoG-PKG FoT 2005: Feast Report From Former Member of CoG-PKG

An eyewitness report from the Feast of Tabernacles 2005, as experienced by the Church of God, Preparing for the Kingdom of God.

“…..It was during this visit [Spring 2005] that we had a conversation with Weinland concerning his adaptation of the baptismal beliefs.…..And he matter-of-factly told us that anyone baptized at this time would not achieve the same “status” as members baptized years earlier we were very surprised and taken-aback at such a blatantly Unbiblical belief……Weinland brushed us off with essentially a “accept what I’ve said” PERIOD. No arguing. After a few more attempts [to argue the point with Weinland citing scriptures], we finally decided this was one of those “agree to disagree” situations.

Over that summer [2005] Weinland suffered his heart attack. This was alarming to us as we felt that an event like that should cause a person to wonder if God is “telling them something.” Yet we saw no evidence of self-examination in Weinland’s actions or behavior.

As the Feast approached, we were beginning to have other little niggling feelings that something was just not right, yet we had no other place to go for the Feast and so we packed up and traveled to Tennessee. The Feast that awaited us was like nothing we have experienced before or since.

The first thing that struck us was an overwhelming “deadness” in the members. One of the buzz words among splinters is a “sleeping” state of members in some COGs. To us, it appeared as if Weinland’s members were also asleep, but in a very different way. It was startling and unsettling when we began to actually spend time with some members. They seemed to almost be in trances.

As the Feast began we were again startled to learn that almost every sermon would be delivered by Weinland and Weinland alone – and he had an important agenda at this Feast. [Feast of Tabernacles 2005]

There would be no encouraging and motivating sermons about the World Tomorrow or the Milennium. No…the plan for this Feast was to share with the members Weinland’s newest doctrinal understanding. The humanization of Jesus Christ – another of Weinland’s “Pet Doctrines.”

It seems that Christ was NOT the God of the Old Testament, but did not exist until he was born to Mary.

What followed after this initial revelation was what we affectionately call the “NOT ONE WORD” sermon, where the members were sternly admonished not to verbalize ONE WORD of dissention or disagreement amonst ourselves. He threatened immediate removal of anyone disobeying this directive.

Weinland then proceeded to utilize the entire Feast to pitch his new doctrine. We learned that this was actually a long-held belief of his and he had never accepted or even taught the WCG’s doctrine about Jesus Christ’s God-head position. He covered all the bases, telling us that the translation of certain pertinent verses was flawed and that lay members could not possibly hope to understand scripture of this magnitude without the help of educated ministers such as himself. [Weinland was “educated” at the Bricket Wood campus of Ambassador College, the unaccredited Worldwide Church of God college]

As the Feast continued, we [were] dismayed and saddened by what we witnessed in the brethren around us. At first there was general shock and surprise as everyone reacted to the new “understanding.” Very few would actually talk about their thoughts about the matter except to say that they were fervently “praying for understanding” and “praying for enlightenment.” There was a bit of unsettlement as these “entranced” members seemed to be struggling with accepting the new doctrine. It was almost as if some of them “woke up” a bit ~ but it was short-lived. As the days of the Feast passed, the majority breathed a collective sigh of relief as they GOT IT and settled back into their blind stupors.

[We] continued to attend the Feast, but as the members around us scribbled madly in their notebooks, we scribbled madly to refute every point he presented. It wasn’t hard.

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Written by weinlandwatch

March 30, 2008 at 7:28 pm

Posted in Uncategorized

8 Responses

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  1. “We learned that this was actually a long-held belief of his and he had never accepted or even taught the WCG’s doctrine about Jesus Christ’s God-head position.”

    weinlandwatch…
    I’m certain this person is honest in their report. This quote is exactly what RW now claims. So the quote is accurate. HOWEVER it is totally a lie from RW. Not incorrect, not mistaken, not Hillary Clinton ‘oh I’m human too’… it’s a lie.

    In the later 1990’s (not sure of the exact year) Ron Weinland almost disfellowshipped a man from southern Michigan for claiming this very exact idea. Threatened him right there on the spot. There were eye-witnesses to this.

    If I may speculate briefly –
    RW wants to believe Jesus Christ is a created being. If Jesus is a created being, a man, and has been raised up to the right-hand of God, then that can be done by RW as well. Perhaps he fancies he will be raised to the right hand of Jesus.

    Richard_Saunders

    March 30, 2008 at 7:59 pm

  2. One more thing weinlandwatch. I hope you don’t see this as preaching, but if you do then delete this post as you see fit and I will understand. I would like to use the Bible to counter RW’s claim here. One short selection, 6 verses, with commentary.

    (ZECH. 2: 8-13)
    8 For thus says the LORD of hosts: “He sent Me after glory, to the nations which plunder you; for he who touches you touches the apple of His eye.
    >> Notice this is the LORD (YHWH) of Hosts speaking, and He says someone SENT Him to save His people. RW claims YHWH is the Father’s personal name. Who can send the Father? No one! However, Jesus MANY times says the Father sent Him. For example, read John 8.

    9 For surely I will shake My hand against them, and they shall become spoil for their servants. Then you will know that the LORD of hosts has sent Me.
    >> Once again, NO ONE sends the Father anywhere. Yet this is YHWH of Hosts speaking. Notice that the YHWH of Hosts says plainly that the YHWH of Hosts has sent Him.

    10 “Sing and rejoice, O daughter of Zion! For behold, I am coming and I will dwell in your midst,” says the LORD.
    >> Who is coming to dwell with men? It isn’t the Father, but the Son!

    11 “Many nations shall be joined to the LORD in that day, and they shall become My people. And I will dwell in your midst. Then you will know that the LORD of hosts has sent Me to you.
    >> And again, the YHWH of Hosts, who is speaking, says the YHWH of Hosts has sent Him. Now, pay very close attention to the next verse.

    12 And the LORD will take possession of Judah as His inheritance in the Holy Land, and will again choose Jerusalem. 13 Be silent, all flesh, before the LORD, for He is aroused from His holy habitation!”
    >> And the YHWH will INHERIT?? How can the Father ‘inherit’ anything? He is in possession of all things! And the word does in absolute fact mean to inherit. Who inherits? The Son inherits from the Father, this is consistent with many scriptures. CLEARLY we see the Son called YHWH as well as YHWH of Hosts. While at the same time we see the Father called YHWH of Hosts.

    JESUS IS YHWH! RW has deceived everyone who believes him.

    Richard_Saunders

    March 30, 2008 at 8:06 pm

  3. Thanks for that Richard, it is important information on just how Weinland will change his story, as circumstances suit.

    FWIW, I seem to recall that briefly in the early ’90s, some members of WCG flirted with Messianic Judaism and binitarianism, as a sort of internal backlash against the revised “What is the Nature of….God?” booklet the church was quietly distributing to various congregations’ libraries (promoting the trinitarianism the Tkaches wanted the members to convert to, in order to stop the cult-watch groups from nosing around).

    Not to mention the PGR around ’93 or so, which most members just dismissed completely out of hand as Tkach Sr. was quite clearly a few cards short of a full deck…….

    weinlandwatch

    March 30, 2008 at 8:09 pm

  4. With regards to your “biblical” comment: I think it is fairly easy for any of us, atheist, agnostic, or theist of a different religion than christianity, to “disprove” Weinland with the bible. I’m not sure I grasp what you’re trying to get at here though.

    WCG did teach (at least from what I can recall) that the christ figure was human, hence, “god gave his only begotten son”, so that the sacrifice could be made. I.e., binitarianism. Of course WCG never went so far as to say that the christ figure didn’t exist prior to the time of it/his becoming human, the christ figure was a part of the god family, as all baptized WCG members would be, after the end of the world.

    Weinland has only put his own particular “stamp” on the theology, it’s really nothing new; he’s just added a twist to standard Armstrongism that makes his CoG unique amongst the rest.

    As far as unitarianism, binitarianism, and trinitarianism is concerned, I commend to true spiritual seekers the theology of panentheism; it definitively puts all that “god-in-one-box-two-boxes-three-boxes” stuff to bed! 🙂

    (Now if that doesn’t earn me at least one “It’s demon-possessed brethren!” in next Saturday’s sermon, I’m not doing my job right. 🙂 )

    weinlandwatch

    March 30, 2008 at 8:25 pm

  5. Let me explain what I was trying to say. I’m terrible at this, so please bear with me as I fumble.

    Ron says that YHWH Elohim is God the Father’s real name. YHWH being His first name, Elohim being His family name. He claims no one is ever called YHWH except the Father, not even Jesus. Jesus’ name is Yashua Elohim, or some such thing. I tried to give evidence that he’s all wet.

    He says Jesus is never actually in the Old Testament except prophetically speaking or in metaphor. He’s got a myriad of excuses, slight of hand, and mostly incredibly poor mistranslations, but if one is kook enough one might even believe him. This however refutes his main point.

    Man I hope that makes sense.

    Richard_Saunders

    March 30, 2008 at 8:42 pm

  6. Ah I see where you’re coming from. Yes, the elohim thing is classic Armstrongism, as is the “messiah foretold” scriptures in the OT. As for the Yashua/name of the christ figure thing, that’s Messianic Judaism, which Weinland is clearly competing with (and is why he excoriates Sacred Namism so badly during the course of most of his sermons).

    As I said above, it’s easy enough for anyone to disprove Weinland’s “teachings”, from the bible or just plain common sense. It is the harm Weinland is bringing down on the members of his church that needs to be dealt with, regardless of where one “stands” theologically with regards to the CoG-PKG. In my opinion.

    weinlandwatch

    March 30, 2008 at 8:50 pm

  7. Agreed!

    Richard_Saunders

    March 30, 2008 at 8:53 pm

  8. Unfortunately for the members of Weinland’s congregation though, they actually aren’t “the elect of god”. They’re just people suckered in by the draw of Armstrongism’s frightening threats of Armageddon—and the heady promise that, if they’re “converted” enough, they will escape the “great tribulation” unscathed.

    My response to this? Armstrong (and his theological descendants) have been preaching “Armageddon is nigh!” for over seventy-five years. Do you realize what that means?

    Three-quarters of a century later, that kingdom still ain’t come yet!

    weinlandwatch

    March 31, 2008 at 3:38 pm


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